[ANN] WebCharm Free v1.1 released

[Long]

WebCharm is an advanced template processing engine for delivering
generated web content. Advanced features can be added to a web site
(without additional programming) through the use of high level
custom tags. Version 1.1 contains many improvements making it
even more easy to learn and use.

WebCharm is now FREE to individuals for non-commercial use. For
more information and product download, visit us at

www.edgesoft.ca/go/index.html

Best Regards,

--
Long On
Systems Architect
Edgesoft Consulting Inc.
long at edgesoft dot ca
www.edgesoft.ca/go/index.html

 

[Leif K-Brooks]

WebCharm is an advanced template processing engine for delivering
generated web content. Advanced features can be added to a web site
(without additional programming) through the use of high level
custom tags. Version 1.1 contains many improvements making it
even more easy to learn and use.

I'll give it a second look when it stops abusing tables and becomes open
source.

 

[Long]

: Long wrote:
:
: > WebCharm is an advanced template processing engine for delivering
: > generated web content. Advanced features can be added to a web site
: > (without additional programming) through the use of high level
: > custom tags. Version 1.1 contains many improvements making it
: > even more easy to learn and use.
:
: I'll give it a second look when it stops abusing tables and becomes open
: source.

I assume you are refering our web site using nested tables for layout.

What would you suggest as a solution to minimize browser incompatibilities?
I would definitely be interested to know if a better method is available.
In any case, WebCharm is not the culprit as it is only processing what it was
given (i.e. nested tables).

Cheers,

Long

 

[Toby A Inkster]

www.edgesoft.ca/go/index.html

I'm not entirely sure what advantages this has over regular SSI.

Indeed, it seems to be computationally less efficient, in that SSI is
implemented in Apache by a module that runs in the same process as the
Apache binary. Whereas with WebCharm, when a page is requested, a CGI
script has to be fired up as a seperate process which communicates with
the main WebCharm process via TCP (and, why not use Unix sockets instead
for added security?)

 

[Leif K-Brooks]

I assume you are refering our web site using nested tables for layout.

Tables for layout purposes in general, not just nested tables.

What would you suggest as a solution to minimize browser incompatibilities?

CSS. Older browsers won't render your pages with pretty colors, but
users will still see all of your content.

 

[Peter Foti]

Tables for layout purposes in general, not just nested tables.
incompatibilities?

CSS. Older browsers won't render your pages with pretty colors, but
users will still see all of your content.

And people with disabilities will have better access to your content as well
(if you use CSS for presentation and forego the tables-for-layout approach).

Regards,
Peter Foti

 

[Long]

: Long wrote:
:
: > www.edgesoft.ca/go/index.html
:
: I'm not entirely sure what advantages this has over regular SSI.
:
: Indeed, it seems to be computationally less efficient, in that SSI is
: implemented in Apache by a module that runs in the same process as the
: Apache binary. Whereas with WebCharm, when a page is requested, a CGI
: script has to be fired up as a seperate process which communicates with
: the main WebCharm process via TCP (and, why not use Unix sockets instead
: for added security?)
:
Granted, SSI is tightly coupled with the web server and therefore does benefit
in terms of performance. However, in considering advantages one should look
at overal feature benefits as well.

WebCharm delivers functionality through custom tags that are preprogrammed
to perform specific tasks. Its main goal is to reduce programming needs. When
marking up a tag, all one needs to do is specify a tag name and required parameters
(as defined by the tag syntax). Of course, one can include JavaScript for browser
side functionality, if desired.

I do not understand your comment about "Unix socket". The CGI bridge is a
binary program (< 50K) and it does communicate with the WebCharm
process via a TCP socket (a native socket), depending on the hosting
platform. In terms of security concerns, we have addressed the issues here

www.edgesoft.ca/go/wcindex.html?top=wcig40

Cheers,

Long

 

[Long]

: : > Long wrote:
: >
: > > I assume you are refering our web site using nested tables for layout.
: >
: > Tables for layout purposes in general, not just nested tables.
: >
: > > What would you suggest as a solution to minimize browser
: incompatibilities?
: >
: > CSS. Older browsers won't render your pages with pretty colors, but
: > users will still see all of your content.
:
I do use CSS, but only minimally. I had a previous experience with CSS where a
3 column layout was used, but the layout looked really bad in an older NS browser.

: And people with disabilities will have better access to your content as well
: (if you use CSS for presentation and forego the tables-for-layout approach).
:
I have no idea what the needs of people with disabilities are and why CSS
would help. Some browsers still can't preserve CSS layout properly.

Regards,

Long

 

[Leif K-Brooks]

Long wrote:

I do use CSS, but only minimally. I had a previous experience with CSS where a
3 column layout was used, but the layout looked really bad in an older NS browser.

That's why you hide your CSS file from NS4 entirely. Morons who still
use it will see your page's content, it just won't be as pretty.

 

[Nick Kew]

I'm not entirely sure what advantages this has over regular SSI.

We had this discussion when he spammed us a few weeks ago.
Like so many reinvented wheels, it's not exactly round.

 

[Long]

: In article <[email protected]>, one of infinite monkeys
:
: > I'm not entirely sure what advantages this has over regular SSI.
:
: We had this discussion when he spammed us a few weeks ago.
: Like so many reinvented wheels, it's not exactly round.
:
How did you come to that conclusion (reinvented wheels)? If you had
actually examine the advance features that WebCharm delivers you would
have something better to say.

Can you show me how SSI can be used to do the following?

- webskins
- one template web site
- random banners
- query string handling like index.html?a=what&b=is&c=wc

Long

 

[Peter Foti]

I do use CSS, but only minimally. I had a previous experience with CSS where a
3 column layout was used, but the layout looked really bad in an older NS

browser.

Fortunately, the older NS browsers are obsolete now, and the number of
people still them are relatively low. The solution for obsolete browsers
(and all browsers for that matter) should be first and foremost to make sure
the content is accessible. So hide your CSS from those old browsers and let
the page degrade gracefully. If you have semantically correct HTML, it
should be presentable in older browsers, and extra presentation can be
applied using CSS for modern browsers.

: And people with disabilities will have better access to your content as well
: (if you use CSS for presentation and forego the tables-for-layout approach).
:
I have no idea what the needs of people with disabilities are and why CSS
would help. Some browsers still can't preserve CSS layout properly.

A blind person, for example, might use an aural browser. If you use tables
for layout, the aural browser has no way of knowing that it's not a data
table, and the order in which is reads the contents might not be correct.
However, if you write semantically correct HTML, then your content will be
rendered in a way that makes sense, whether it's being read by an aural
browser, or re-arranged on the display by visual browsers.

You can learn more about accessibility here:
http://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG10/

Regards,
Peter

 

[Long]

[snip]
:
: You can learn more about accessibility here:
: http://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG10/
:
Very informative! I will look further and see if our site can be improved.

Thanks Peter,

Long

 

[Joel Shepherd]

That's why you hide your CSS file from NS4 entirely.

I've yet to have to "entirely" hide CSS from NS4. It's sufficient to
hide what it can't safely handle, and let it enjoy the rest.

Morons who still use it...

Don't deserve to be called morons, for one thing. Sitting at whatever
wonderful, all-open-source (right?) machine you have, you have no way
of knowing why a visitor to your site might be using NS4. For as much
and as little as you know, they may have no choice. Hate the browser
if you want: you have no grounds for disparaging its users as a class.

 

[Long]

: Leif K-Brooks wrote:
: >
: > That's why you hide your CSS file from NS4 entirely.
:
: I've yet to have to "entirely" hide CSS from NS4. It's sufficient to
: hide what it can't safely handle, and let it enjoy the rest.
:
: > Morons who still use it...
:
: Don't deserve to be called morons, for one thing. Sitting at whatever
: wonderful, all-open-source (right?) machine you have, you have no way
: of knowing why a visitor to your site might be using NS4. For as much
: and as little as you know, they may have no choice. Hate the browser
: if you want: you have no grounds for disparaging its users as a class.
:
Well said...

Long

 

[Toby A Inkster]

Can you show me how SSI can be used to do the following?

- webskins
- one template web site
- random banners
- query string handling like index.html?a=what&b=is&c=wc

SSI allows you to include scripts:

<!--#include virtual="example.pl" -->

Of course, once you do this, you're really using CGI just with an SSI-like
syntax.

 

[Long]

: Long wrote:
:
: > Can you show me how SSI can be used to do the following?
: >
: > - webskins
: > - one template web site
: > - random banners
: > - query string handling like index.html?a=what&b=is&c=wc
:
: SSI allows you to include scripts:
:
: <!--#include virtual="example.pl" -->
:
: Of course, once you do this, you're really using CGI just with an SSI-like
: syntax.
:
Of course, and in addition I would have to learn Perl? or is it Python?
How much programming would I have to do to add the above list
of features to my web site?

Basically, SSI alone can't do any of the above. So I wonder why you implied
WebCharm is a re-invention of SSI?

With WebCharm, no additional programming is needed:

- webskins - <!--@topic skin 1 bgcolors.txt@-->

- one template site - <!--@topic top 0 pgtopics.txt@-->

- random banners - <!--@random 1 banners.txt@-->

- query string handling - automatic when using the @topic tag so that I can
specify a link request like index.html?top=wc&skin=iscool

In practice, there is a bit more work to get things ready, but not much more.

Long

 

[Nick Kew]

How did you come to that conclusion (reinvented wheels)?

Where have you been for the past eight or nine years? There are
thoussands of in-markup publishing systems out there. Most of them
are dead or limited to one or two users; but a few winners like PHP
are in widespread use. Frankly I'm no great fan of PHP either, but
I'd pick something that's, stable, well-supported and in widespread
use over something "free for personal use" from a single source who
touts a typical-of-1995 script as new.

Come back when you've got something new. Since you're clearly keen
to write something worthwhile, here's a hint: don't expect people
to learn a proprietary language; implement a recognised standard
instead. There are plenty of standards out there waiting for a
robust and stable implementation on the Web.

 

[Long]

: In article <[email protected]>, one of infinite
monkeys
: :
: > How did you come to that conclusion (reinvented wheels)?
:
: Where have you been for the past eight or nine years? There are
: thoussands of in-markup publishing systems out there. Most of them
: are dead or limited to one or two users; but a few winners like PHP
: are in widespread use. Frankly I'm no great fan of PHP either, but
: I'd pick something that's, stable, well-supported and in widespread
: use over something "free for personal use" from a single source who
: touts a typical-of-1995 script as new.
:
Apparently, you ignored the list of features I presented. All I ask is that
you present technologies to date that can provide those features without
much work or difficulties.

Where have I been? I've been in the computer fields long enough to
have developed something useful. What have you got to show (efsoym)?

: Come back when you've got something new. Since you're clearly keen
: to write something worthwhile, here's a hint: don't expect people
: to learn a proprietary language; implement a recognised standard
: instead. There are plenty of standards out there waiting for a
: robust and stable implementation on the Web.
:
Language? What language? Why are you still writing code?

"Just keep swimming, keep swimming, just keep coding, keep coding..."

Stop being so ignorant.

 

[Eric B. Bednarz]

"Nick Kew" wrote...

What have you got to show (efsoym)?

Very funny; had you been reading the groups you drop your
ad^Hnnouncements in, you wouldn't need to ask. But that's hardly
surprising, is it?

Stop being so ignorant.

Start consulting a Usenet primer.
Until you collected some clues, have a nice life.