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Message: [QUOTE="Stephen Hansen, post: 4087610"] I didn't miss it at all; I just didn't accept (and still don't -entirely-) that positioning within an explicitly sized div is the same thing as one which has had a flow-determined size. But! That said: Very nice. And interesting. "position: absolute" there is a mystery to me and seems to be key, I'm not sure entirely what it is doing to the layout manager in that scenario, but it seems to do the trick. Much, much, much Googling led me to try many things to get it just right, and all bemoaned the lack of a solid way to vertically center: all the while using essentially similar methods to horizontally center. Anyways. :) -- Stephen Hansen ... Also: Ixokai ... Mail: me+list/python (AT) ixokai (DOT) io ... Blog: [URL]http://meh.ixokai.io/[/URL] -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.10 (Darwin) iQEbBAEBAgAGBQJMFt4rAAoJEKcbwptVWx/lJScH8gLHRjA1JYz0nl3y4vo+FvWS j6xOlkPMp/STcAdA9ALqi4YfTjosuIrSiCVsxo7vfPK/pU/jU9lqA5/ITb5BwFDK gQh92Or7LL3mdNXCqld/ZZcxwDoU9Wv/IsiETaZbX4/A/MlTl/8X+2ZPlUc4g3dd TcIlnIu218aWa7dvCegHarRWXrNlbWoDEi6EWE0j7TFEnV/MULC1KLcvZ9GDRRA1 jhBa1P9clVRcQMesPLy4DufpnHPlM9bBFrsypL/hpl/X4fuUPAiS+vKKyjt4FbQh 6kJaLEEzIcmq50ZyKunUG37Tpb/Z5107an1QBMngbPonLTqTJXpo96SDUI+WQA== =z8v2 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- [/QUOTE]