Remember Java Applets?

[cwdjrxyz]

Flash visual effects have now taken over most moving image effects for
ads, and I am well aware of how many here dislike that use of flash.
However many years ago animated gifs, dhtml, and Java were often used
to make images move for ads. I have not seen a Java applet used for an
annoying ad in many years. For an example of one of the most
elaborate Java applet effects I know, see http://www.cwdjr.net/java/Weather/weather.html
.. You will also see flash used in the code, but this is only for the
audio. The applet can also use audio, but only in an older format for
which I do not have a converter program - mpg and wav will not work in
the applet. This applet, if autostarted, would make an ad that is as
annoying as most modern flash ones. The marquee effect is done with
Java, not with the marquee html tag. The message might read "Had your
roof(or furnace) inspected recently? Call RipOff Inc. for a free
inspection." Java applets will only validate at the W3C in
transitional html or transitional xhtml.

 

[Neredbojias]

Flash visual effects have now taken over most moving image effects
for ads, and I am well aware of how many here dislike that use of
flash. However many years ago animated gifs, dhtml, and Java were
often used to make images move for ads. I have not seen a Java applet
used for an annoying ad in many years. For an example of one of the
most elaborate Java applet effects I know, see
http://www.cwdjr.net/java/Weather/weather.html . You will also see
flash used in the code, but this is only for the audio. The applet
can also use audio, but only in an older format for which I do not
have a converter program - mpg and wav will not work in the applet.
This applet, if autostarted, would make an ad that is as annoying as
most modern flash ones. The marquee effect is done with Java, not
with the marquee html tag. The message might read "Had your roof(or
furnace) inspected recently? Call RipOff Inc. for a free inspection."
Java applets will only validate at the W3C in transitional html or
transitional xhtml.

And your point is..?

 

[cwdjrxyz]

And your point is..?

Java is still around, but mainly used for programming purposes such as
on control panels for some servers. Although the use of Java applets
for web pages can still produce elaborate effects for web pages, it
likely is little used anymore, especially by those who write html
pages for profit, because it often requires much more time than flash
and one must know the Java language well. Then it is likely that many
have Java turned off because few web pages require it anymore. Many
years ago you had to have Java enabled to view parts of our local
public library's site, but I can not think of any web page I use much
anymore that requires Java to be on to avoid missing important
content.

 

[Travis Newbury]

Java is still around, but...

The reason people started going more with Flash is that is actually
works on everyone's computer. Java's write once play everywhere idea
never really worked. Incompatible versions of java, and missing or
incompatible pieces were always a an issue, backwards compatibility
was almost ignored.

Now with Actionscript and the server scritping of your choice, and
interfaces such as air you have the ability to write client, server,
or combination based applications. Flash is now what Java wanted to
be.

With Adobe integrating all of their applications it makes creating
"fancy" websites even easier. Many of the "fancy Flash" I create for
sites is realy a mixture of video, after effects or blender motion
graphics, and Flash animations.

In conclusion....
It works
It's a powerful application development tool
It's relativly easy to learn
virtually everyone can see it (though some choose not to)
and as developers begin to learn to use actionscript for animations it
can produce some mighty small files.

 

[rf]

Java is still around, but...

The reason people started going more with Flash is that is actually
works on everyone's computer.

Not on mine, it doesn't.

 

[Travis Newbury]

mine either.  I looked at dnlding it, its humongous.

There is a difference between "can't see it" and "decided not to see
it"

 

[Travis Newbury]

I was not claiming the 2 to be the same, Mr. Non Sequitur

If you weren't then your post makes no sense at all based on the
thread.

Me: "Worked on everyone's machine"
RF: "Not mine"
You: "mine either I looked at dnlding it, its humongous."
Me: "There is a difference...

See RF said it would not work on his computer. Well, based on past
conversations with RF, it is not a matter of IF it works, but he
chooses it NOT to work. Then you joined in and said it did not work
on your machine either. Then you commented that it was humongous.
Well I had to decide if you meant Flash objects, or Flash the
application.

If you meant Flash objects, then I addressed that earlier stating a
GOOD flash developer (the minority) creates small flash objects. If
you were talking about the application then, WTF, of course it was
HUMONGOUS it is a sophisticated development and testing environment.
If it is too big to download, then by the DVD to install it.

No matter which direction your mind was headed, my answer that "can
not" and "decided not to" are two different things still stands as a
valid statement.

 

[rf]

I didn't read the past conversations with RF

What Travis is complaining about is that I have flashblock installed, so
flash does not work on my computer unless I specifically request it, and
that's not often.

Flash does not work on my computer because I have exercised a choice.

It sounds like flash also does not wook on your computer because you, too,
have exercised a choice, that of not dnlding a humongous file.

Be it because our browsers do not support flash, flash is not installed,
flash is blocked, flash is too bloody big to download, the reason is
immaterial. The bottom line is that flash does not work on our computers.

 

[Travis Newbury]

What Travis is complaining about is that I have flashblock installed, so
flash does not work on my computer unless I specifically request it, and
that's not often.

Flash does not work on my computer because I have exercised a choice.

It sounds like flash also does not wook on your computer because you, too,
have exercised a choice, that of not dnlding a humongous file.

Be it because our browsers do not support flash, flash is not installed,
flash is blocked, flash is too bloody big to download, the reason is
immaterial. The bottom line is that flash does not work on our computers.

No, it does work, you have chosen not to view it. But if there was a
website that you absolutely HAD to go to, and there was no
alternative, then you can turn it on, and see flash. So flash works on
your machine, you have simply chosen not to view it. And that is
fine. I to have Flashblock installed and use it regularly to block
most ads, but if I run into a site I have to (want to) see Flash on,
say, youtube, or virtually ALL video sites, not to mention virtually
all porn sites.. Then I, just like you, can easily turn it on. So it
is not a matter of IF it runs, but if you LET it run.

Anyway, my point was that one of the reasons it is so much more
popular than java is it runs on everyone's machine. And you choosing
to not run it on your machine is irrelevant to my point.

 

[dorayme]

Honestly, I cannot remember the last time I encountered a Java-required
site. Certainly not one I really cared about.

When I get worried I might have made a copying or other error in
a Sudoku, I can check to see it is solvable at:

<http://sudoku.sourceforge.net/>

 

[rf]

What Travis is complaining about is that I have flashblock installed, so
flash does not work on my computer unless I specifically request it, and
that's not often.

Flash does not work on my computer because I have exercised a choice.

It sounds like flash also does not wook on your computer because you, too,
have exercised a choice, that of not dnlding a humongous file.

Be it because our browsers do not support flash, flash is not installed,
flash is blocked, flash is too bloody big to download, the reason is
immaterial. The bottom line is that flash does not work on our computers.

No, it does work, you have chosen not to view it. But if there was a
website that you absolutely HAD to go to, and there was no
alternative, then you can turn it on, and see flash. So flash works on
your machine, you have simply chosen not to view it. And that is
fine. I to have Flashblock installed and use it regularly to block
most ads, but if I run into a site I have to (want to) see Flash on,
say, youtube, or virtually ALL video sites, not to mention virtually
all porn sites.. Then I, just like you, can easily turn it on. So it
is not a matter of IF it runs, but if you LET it run.

Anyway, my point was that one of the reasons it is so much more
popular than java is it runs on everyone's machine. And you choosing
to not run it on your machine is irrelevant to my point.

But the point also is that it does NOT run on every machine, not if the
flash requires the latest version of flash and that is not installed.

And don't suggest that my 85 year old mother in law will, when prompted,
install the latest version just to see your ad after I have forbidden her
from installing anything on her computer.

The author of that ad has a choice too. Present the ad using HTML which by
definition will work or present it using flash where it is not gauranteed to
work. The advertiser does not care how the flash didn't work. It simply
didn't work.

 

[dorayme]

Sorry. Sudoku and I don't at all jibe.

I do crosswords every day. I do words. Numbers? Yeah, I crunch them
for our personal budget and all.

Just saying that I think there is a java solving app there.

About Sudoku, it is not really about numbers, just needs 9
different things (they could be letters, travises, universes,
pains - as long as there were nine identifiably different types)

 

[Travis Newbury]

The author of that ad has a choice too. Present the ad using HTML which by
definition will work or present it using flash where it is not gauranteed to
work. The advertiser does not care how the flash didn't work. It simply
didn't work.

Your decision to not view Flash is just that, your decision. But as
bandwidth opens up all over the world and as flash, video, and
multimedia in general become more and more accessible and prominent on
the web, then it is not I who will be left in the dust. Different
people like different things. You don't like flash, fine, don't like
it. No one, including all the advertizers that use Flash, care.

Bottom line is if the Flash ads did not increase their revenue, they
would not use them. You and the tiny group of people not watch them
is obviously irrelevant to the bottom line.

 

[Travis Newbury]

Sorry.  Sudoku and I don't at all jibe.

Ok, change of subject here... How did you fair with the Atlanta
blizzards?

 

[rf]

Your decision to not view Flash is just that, your decision. But as
bandwidth opens up all over the world and as flash, video, and
multimedia in general become more and more accessible and prominent on
the web, then it is not I who will be left in the dust. Different
people like different things. You don't like flash, fine, don't like
it. No one, including all the advertizers that use Flash, care.

Bottom line is if the Flash ads did not increase their revenue, they
would not use them. You and the tiny group of people not watch them
is obviously irrelevant to the bottom line.

OK Travis. Truce time. Sort of.

You know my feelings about flash. But it's probably not just flash in and of
itself but rather the use to which it is put. This can be extended to any
technology, web based or not.

The other day I wandered over to my significant other's computer as it
caught my eye, or rather poked me savagely in the eye with the force of
something like a stick.

She started bitching about this big yellow blob on the bottom right of her
viewport that went "FLASH FLASH *look at me* FLASH FLASH *I'm an ad* FLASH
FLASH". "Can't you turn this bloody thing off for me", she demurely
enquired, "it's stopping me from reading the content of this damn page".
(sorry, don't have the URL, just pick one yourself, best is from anywhere in
..cn).

That is why I have flash disabled. That is now why she does as well. This
stuff used to be done with animated gifs. That was bad enough but now, with
flash, it can be done an order of magnitude worse.

On the other hand there is a site I currently have displayed in a browser
24/7. It uses flash in an admiral manner, exactly as I suspect the inventor
intended it to be used.

http://www.foxtel.com.au/vancouver2010/channels/tv-guide/default.htm

Scroll down to the bit where it tells you what is currently playing.

Very well done. Does the job nicely. Not in your face, just quietly using
the technology to good effect.

Pity about that stupid marquee up there under the menu bar though.

 

[Travis Newbury]

That is why I have flash disabled. That is now why she does as well. This
stuff used to be done with animated gifs. That was bad enough but now, with
flash, it can be done an order of magnitude worse.

Your example is the exact same reason I have Flashblock turned on, and
I completely agree Flash is misused all over the place. But, it also
provides may benefits to the web (I would list but then it would
start a "that's not a benefit" war...)

Flash is not evil, some developers are. But that is not a reason to
kill a technology just because someone abuses it.

 

[William Gill]

OK Travis. Truce time. Sort of.

You know my feelings about flash. But it's probably not just flash in and of
itself but rather the use to which it is put. This can be extended to any
technology, web based or not.

The other day I wandered over to my significant other's computer as it
caught my eye, or rather poked me savagely in the eye with the force of
something like a stick.

She started bitching about this big yellow blob on the bottom right of her
viewport that went "FLASH FLASH *look at me* FLASH FLASH *I'm an ad* FLASH
FLASH". "Can't you turn this bloody thing off for me", she demurely
enquired, "it's stopping me from reading the content of this damn page".
(sorry, don't have the URL, just pick one yourself, best is from anywhere in
.cn).

That is why I have flash disabled. That is now why she does as well. This
stuff used to be done with animated gifs. That was bad enough but now, with
flash, it can be done an order of magnitude worse.

On the other hand there is a site I currently have displayed in a browser
24/7. It uses flash in an admiral manner, exactly as I suspect the inventor
intended it to be used.

http://www.foxtel.com.au/vancouver2010/channels/tv-guide/default.htm

Scroll down to the bit where it tells you what is currently playing.

Very well done. Does the job nicely. Not in your face, just quietly using
the technology to good effect.

Pity about that stupid marquee up there under the menu bar though.

Pretty much the same thing can be said about some "pure" HTML sites
otherwise there wouldn't be so many worst website websites. There is no
accounting for taste (or lack thereof). If you find a way of
legislating and regulating good taste let me know. I'd like to apply
the concept to some of the everyday empty-headedness I encounter.

It's not just that so many can be so clueless, that's their problem.
it's that they can vote, that's everyone else's.