Getting started with Java on a Mac

T

Tom Anderson

I strongly suspect that NetBeans would work too.


desktop apps => Eclipse IDE for Java Developers

server apps => Eclipse IDE for Java EE Developers

Roughly. AIUI, the SQL support is in the EE edition, but not the standard
edition. If you want to use SQL on the desktop, you might like to get the
EE edition.

The EE edition is basically the standard edition with more perspectives
and views. I don't believe it alters anything that's in the standard
edition. So, if you can spare the disk space, i would suggest getting the
EE edition, so you have a pretty complete Java development environment,
even if you don't use much of the EE bits. You never know, at some point,
you might want to write a little web application.

Although, having said all that, i would suggest not starting with an IDE,
or at least not one of any complexity. An editor with automatic
indentation and syntax highlighting will do; TextWrangler is good, and
actually, XCode is a pretty good Java editor, even if it is lacking as an
IDE.

tom
 
L

Lew

Tom said:
Arne said:
desktop apps => Eclipse IDE for Java Developers

server apps => Eclipse IDE for Java EE Developers

Roughly. AIUI, the SQL support is in the EE edition, but not the standard
edition. If you want to use SQL on the desktop, you might like to get the EE
edition.

The EE edition is basically the standard edition with more perspectives and
views. I [sic] don't believe it alters anything that's in the standard edition. So,
if you can spare the disk space, i would suggest getting the EE edition, so
you have a pretty complete Java development environment, even if you don't use
much of the EE bits. You never know, at some point, you might want to write a
little web application.

If you don't have the disk space for the EE edition, you don't have enough
disk space to do Java development. Just get the EE edition.
Although, having said all that, i would suggest not starting with an IDE, or
at least not one of any complexity. An editor with automatic indentation and
syntax highlighting will do; TextWrangler is good, and actually, XCode is a
pretty good Java editor, even if it is lacking as an IDE.

This is controversial advice. The merit of command-line builds is that you
learn your stuff. The downside is you get off to a slightly slower start. I
concur that it is worth the effort to master using Java from the command line.

"What?" you ask. "Who said anything about command line?" Well, if you take
Tom's advice and avoid an IDE, your editor won't do builds, debugging,
classpath management, syntax-checking, expression completion or all the little
Java niceties that the IDEs provide. You also lose the dashboard for resources
like database systems, web servers, application servers, build profiles and
such. You will have to use the command line to build your systems, i.e., the
"java" and "javac" commands, Ant or Maven.

If you use an IDE like NetBeans or Eclipse then you get all that assistance
and convenience, but you might get sloppy in your learning.

I favor a third approach. Use an IDE, but always check your work with a
command-line build in a separately checked-out workspace (you MUST use version
control ALWAYS, even on solo projects). I've worked on major projects
(big-iron Federal systems) where the command-line build differed significantly
from the developers' Eclipse-based ones, and it took two people two days for
each release to convert the Eclipse build data for the official build. If you
find a discrepancy between your IDE build and your command-line build, fix the
former to match the latter. Builds should never rely on a particular IDE or
editor.

As for which editor to use, vi and emacs are just fine in the modern world if
you do eschew an IDE. Which I wouldn't.
 
A

Arne Vajhøj

//www.google.com/search?rls=en&q=java+ide+for+mac+os+x&ie=UTF-8&oe[/URL]

=UTF-8>

One of those might get you started quickly. I haven't used any of them
under Mac OS, so can't recommend any in particular.

It looks like Eclipse might fill the bill,

I strongly suspect that NetBeans would work too.
I need to do some reading to
figure out which version is appropriate - EE, Classic, etc.

desktop apps => Eclipse IDE for Java Developers

server apps => Eclipse IDE for Java EE Developers

Roughly. AIUI, the SQL support is in the EE edition, but not the
standard edition. If you want to use SQL on the desktop, you might like
to get the EE edition.

Support for writing SQL files may be a EE edition thing.

But that is not in my opinion a common thing to do for desktop app
development.

Plain JDBC with embedded SQL or an ORM for writing the code
and then creating the database structure in a database tool.
The EE edition is basically the standard edition with more perspectives
and views. I don't believe it alters anything that's in the standard
edition. So, if you can spare the disk space, i would suggest getting
the EE edition, so you have a pretty complete Java development
environment, even if you don't use much of the EE bits. You never know,
at some point, you might want to write a little web application.
True.

Although, having said all that, i would suggest not starting with an
IDE, or at least not one of any complexity. An editor with automatic
indentation and syntax highlighting will do; TextWrangler is good, and
actually, XCode is a pretty good Java editor, even if it is lacking as
an IDE.

Or jEdit or UltraEdit or NotPad++ or NEdit or ... - there are
plenty of decent editors around.

I agree with the point that every new Java developer should learn
to develop using a standard editor and command line editor to learn
about classpath, jar files etc.etc..

Arne
 
A

Arne Vajhøj

This is controversial advice. The merit of command-line builds is that
you learn your stuff. The downside is you get off to a slightly slower
start. I concur that it is worth the effort to master using Java from
the command line.

"What?" you ask. "Who said anything about command line?" Well, if you
take Tom's advice and avoid an IDE, your editor won't do builds,
debugging, classpath management, syntax-checking, expression completion
or all the little Java niceties that the IDEs provide. You also lose the
dashboard for resources like database systems, web servers, application
servers, build profiles and such. You will have to use the command line
to build your systems, i.e., the "java" and "javac" commands, Ant or Maven.

If you use an IDE like NetBeans or Eclipse then you get all that
assistance and convenience, but you might get sloppy in your learning.

Or never learn at all.
I favor a third approach. Use an IDE, but always check your work with a
command-line build in a separately checked-out workspace (you MUST use
version control ALWAYS, even on solo projects). I've worked on major
projects (big-iron Federal systems) where the command-line build
differed significantly from the developers' Eclipse-based ones, and it
took two people two days for each release to convert the Eclipse build
data for the official build. If you find a discrepancy between your IDE
build and your command-line build, fix the former to match the latter.
Builds should never rely on a particular IDE or editor.

I very much agree on the approach for above beginner level.

I use it myself for most stuff I do.

But the IDE-VCS-CLI setup may be a bit too advanced for the beginner.

Arne
 
T

Tom Anderson

Support for writing SQL files may be a EE edition thing.

But that is not in my opinion a common thing to do for desktop app
development.

Plain JDBC with embedded SQL or an ORM for writing the code
and then creating the database structure in a database tool.

Mostly true. It's useful to have the database view when developing, for
running ad-hoc queries to look at data and so on. Also, for editing the
generated schema to tweak constraints and indices and so on.
Or jEdit or UltraEdit or NotPad++ or NEdit or ... - there are
plenty of decent editors around.

Most of which aren't relevant in a thread about programming on a Mac. I
mentioned TextWrangler and XCode because they're the best freeware editors
on the Mac.
I agree with the point that every new Java developer should learn to
develop using a standard editor and command line editor to learn about
classpath, jar files etc.etc..

Great minds think alike.

tom
 
A

Arne Vajhøj

Mostly true. It's useful to have the database view when developing, for
running ad-hoc queries to look at data and so on. Also, for editing the
generated schema to tweak constraints and indices and so on.

But there are database tools for that.
Most of which aren't relevant in a thread about programming on a Mac. I
mentioned TextWrangler and XCode because they're the best freeware
editors on the Mac.

jEdit and NEdit do run on MacOS X.

Arne
 

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