GUI:-please answer want to learn GUI programming in python , howshould i proceed.

[wxjmfauth]

Addendum.

I should say, I had also a lot of fun in writing my own
"styling engine".

Because when one has to deal with a language, which does
not recognize its own keywords...

tokenize.py could have been a solution, but it's really
too slow.

jmf

 

[Mark Lawrence]

Addendum.

I should say, I had also a lot of fun in writing my own
"styling engine".

Because when one has to deal with a language, which does
not recognize its own keywords...


tokenize.py could have been a solution, but it's really
too slow.

jmf

To what, where is your context, my crystal ball is broken again?

 

[Wolfgang Keller]

Please check JYTHON and those ready-for-novice GUI tools in java.

All Java GUI frameworks I know of are ridiculous garbage.

Not only that Java per se is obscenely fat (and unresponsive), but the
GUI frameworks leak like bottomless barrels and the look and feel is so
hideous that I would say from personal experience with numerous Java
applications that there is little that's worse for user productivity
than a Java application running on Windows. Well, a "web application"
might top it.

Sincerely,

Wolfgang

 

[Wolfgang Keller]

Python is sooooooo slow when it waits for the human.

With Windows systems, I waste something like 90% of my work time waiting
for that system to stop "Not Responding".

And no, it's not a matter of hardware.

Sincerely,

Wolfgang

 

[Wolfgang Keller]

The other thing, specially if you would make a customer project, I

don't know how to pack the app written in python in an installer.

If you want your application to be actually user-friendly, you make it
available as an installer-less zip archive. It works with Python
applications, no matter whether they use PyGTK, wxPython or PyQt.

Perhaps I am wrong, and you could give me in exchange an advise ?!

Python is probably the "best" language for application implementation in
general. Anything that would really need to be faster than python
itself allows can easily be implemented in "compiled" Python à la Pyrex
et al.

I also believe in performance. An application written in C++, can be
compiled easily on the target platform (like on windows systems) with
it's native compiler.
How would it be with wxPython ?!

It isn't an issue.

With that pathological non-operating system Microsoft (Not Responding),
as soon as your application has to do any I/O, or if there's any other
process (virus scanner, file system indexer) running that does I/O,
any computer will be unusable for productive work anyway.

On an actual operating system, the attitude of the developers (do they
actually care or just don't give a darn) is *the* critical issue for
end-user productivity. If a developer makes a statement such as
of "just get a faster computer" or "just get more RAM", then (s)he
probably doesn't give darn. C++ applications, just like Java
applications, tend to leak horrible amounts of memory these days, just
because the vendors/developers don't care.

Sincerely,

Wolfgang

 

[Wolfgang Keller]

And besides, again, a commercially licensed PyQt itself isn't *that*
expensive.

The cost of a commercial PyQt license for a single developer is £350
(GBP). You may pay in either US Dollars, Euros or GBP.

[/QUOTE]

I didn't write the second paragraph. Please learn to quote, thanks.

(£420 incl. VAT for UK and select EU entities)

For a commercial developer that doesn't appear much to me. I know Qt
applications that cost ~100.000 EUR per seat. Others are so valuable
that they simply aren't sold at all.

Wingware since recently uses PyQt and their prices don't seem to have
skyrocketed since the migration from PyGTK.

one [license] per developer

For some people, it might be a lot. Why waste money on something,
that has an almost-identical free-for-everyone version? (which also is
easier to install, BTW)

Because PySide is *far* from identical.

Thanks again for learning to quote correctly. I did not write this
paragraph.

So, you have four options:

If you need something that's actually supported, Pyside (currently)
doesn't look like a credible option to me.

And for "home users", education etc., the GPL version of PyQt seems
perfect to me.

Sincerely,

Wolfgang

 

[Michael Torrie]

With Windows systems, I waste something like 90% of my work time waiting
for that system to stop "Not Responding".

And no, it's not a matter of hardware.

Something is wrong then. Windows has its issues, and it does slow down
over time as cruft in the system accumulates. And Windows XP is getting
slower and slower due to a bug in the automatic updates service, but in
general, but your experience with Windows is not normal. I managed
hundreds of Windows workstations in my previous life and I did not see
this occur with any regularity. So something is wrong with your setup.
Maybe its time for a re-install? Virus or malware? Or maybe you need
to upgrade to Windows 7?

 

[Terry Reedy]

On an actual operating system, the attitude of the developers (do they
actually care or just don't give a darn) is *the* critical issue for
end-user productivity. If a developer makes a statement such as
of "just get a faster computer" or "just get more RAM", then (s)he
probably doesn't give darn. C++ applications, just like Java
applications, tend to leak horrible amounts of memory these days, just
because the vendors/developers don't care.

I'll note that Python core developers do care about memory leaks. At
least one module is tested for memory leaks in a nightly task. When
found, leaks are patched.

 

[Michael Torrie]

All Java GUI frameworks I know of are ridiculous garbage.

Not only that Java per se is obscenely fat (and unresponsive), but the
GUI frameworks leak like bottomless barrels and the look and feel is so
hideous that I would say from personal experience with numerous Java
applications that there is little that's worse for user productivity
than a Java application running on Windows. Well, a "web application"
might top it.

Pray tell is there anything that is not ridiculous garbage or is your
computer so hopelessly broken that everything fails on it? You've
already dissed on Windows, Firefox, the web, Java. Surely Python must
suck also because it's slow and interpreted.

 

[wxjmfauth]

Le mardi 17 décembre 2013 19:06:35 UTC+1, Michael Torrie a écrit :

Something is wrong then. Windows has its issues, and it does slow down

over time as cruft in the system accumulates. And Windows XP is getting

slower and slower due to a bug in the automatic updates service, but in

general, but your experience with Windows is not normal. I managed

hundreds of Windows workstations in my previous life and I did not see

this occur with any regularity. So something is wrong with your setup.

Maybe its time for a re-install? Virus or malware? Or maybe you need

to upgrade to Windows 7?

I tend to agree with you. However, I should say
I'm observing a strange phenomenon.

Among others, I wrote two interactive interpreters
with PySide 1.1.2 for Python 3.3 and Python 3.2.

If I'm runing such a task with Py3.2 (more than a minute)

it runs smoothly.

but if I run the same task with Py3.3

my window seems to be idled, and a message like,
Ne répond pas (something like "Do no respond")
appeares in the title bar of the window (my application
title + that msg). The cursor get transformed into the
win7 "waiting cursor".

The app seems to freeze, but in fact, it is not and
the resulting values are correct.

How do I know this? Very simple, the resulting
values are in exact concordance with the values
I obtain with my interactive intepreters, but
built with tkinter!

jmf

 

[Mark Lawrence]

Le mardi 17 décembre 2013 19:06:35 UTC+1, Michael Torrie a écrit :



I tend to agree with you. However, I should say
I'm observing a strange phenomenon.

Among others, I wrote two interactive interpreters
with PySide 1.1.2 for Python 3.3 and Python 3.2.

If I'm runing such a task with Py3.2 (more than a minute)


it runs smoothly.

but if I run the same task with Py3.3

my window seems to be idled, and a message like,
Ne répond pas (something like "Do no respond")
appeares in the title bar of the window (my application
title + that msg). The cursor get transformed into the
win7 "waiting cursor".

The app seems to freeze, but in fact, it is not and
the resulting values are correct.

How do I know this? Very simple, the resulting
values are in exact concordance with the values
I obtain with my interactive intepreters, but
built with tkinter!

jmf

Have I understood this correctly? Your users are using a GUI that
you've designed and implemented, they type in 100000 identical
characters and then search linearly for a single character that they
know can't possibly be found, and then they are complaining that their
systems are too slow, yes?

 

[wxjmfauth]

Le mardi 17 décembre 2013 20:00:14 UTC+1, (e-mail address removed) a écrit :

Le mardi 17 décembre 2013 19:06:35 UTC+1, Michael Torrie a écrit :








I tend to agree with you. However, I should say

I'm observing a strange phenomenon.



Among others, I wrote two interactive interpreters

with PySide 1.1.2 for Python 3.3 and Python 3.2.



If I'm runing such a task with Py3.2 (more than a minute)






it runs smoothly.



but if I run the same task with Py3.3



my window seems to be idled, and a message like,

Ne répond pas (something like "Do no respond")

appeares in the title bar of the window (my application

title + that msg). The cursor get transformed into the

win7 "waiting cursor".



The app seems to freeze, but in fact, it is not and

the resulting values are correct.



How do I know this? Very simple, the resulting

values are in exact concordance with the values

I obtain with my interactive intepreters, but

built with tkinter!

Installation of PySide 1.2.1 for Py32, Py33
-> same effect.

win32, shiboken, Visual Studio, Qt: ???

jmf

 

[Mark Lawrence]

On 18/12/2013 09:24, (e-mail address removed) wrote:

[once again snip all the double spaced crap from google groups]

Installation of PySide 1.2.1 for Py32, Py33
-> same effect.

win32, shiboken, Visual Studio, Qt: ???

jmf

The point of this is?

 

[wxjmfauth]

Le mardi 17 décembre 2013 20:00:14 UTC+1, (e-mail address removed) a écrit :

Le mardi 17 décembre 2013 19:06:35 UTC+1, Michael Torrie a écrit :








I tend to agree with you. However, I should say

I'm observing a strange phenomenon.



Among others, I wrote two interactive interpreters

with PySide 1.1.2 for Python 3.3 and Python 3.2.



If I'm runing such a task with Py3.2 (more than a minute)






it runs smoothly.



but if I run the same task with Py3.3



my window seems to be idled, and a message like,

Ne répond pas (something like "Do no respond")

appeares in the title bar of the window (my application

title + that msg). The cursor get transformed into the

win7 "waiting cursor".



The app seems to freeze, but in fact, it is not and

the resulting values are correct.



How do I know this? Very simple, the resulting

values are in exact concordance with the values

I obtain with my interactive intepreters, but

built with tkinter!

Same experience with PyQt4.

Py 3.2 : PyQt4.QtCore.PYQT_VERSION_STR -> 4.8.6
Py 3.3 : PyQt4.QtCore.PYQT_VERSION_STR -> 4.10

jmf

 

[Mark Lawrence]

Same experience with PyQt4.

Py 3.2 : PyQt4.QtCore.PYQT_VERSION_STR -> 4.8.6
Py 3.3 : PyQt4.QtCore.PYQT_VERSION_STR -> 4.10

jmf

Your point being?

 

[wxjmfauth]

Le jeudi 19 décembre 2013 09:25:14 UTC+1, Mark Lawrence a écrit :

Your point being?



--

My fellow Pythonistas, ask not what our language can do for you, ask

what you can do for our language.

The point is:
Py3.3 and "Qt" on Windows 7 pro does not work.

jmf

 

[Mark Lawrence]

Le jeudi 19 décembre 2013 09:25:14 UTC+1, Mark Lawrence a écrit :

The point is:
Py3.3 and "Qt" on Windows 7 pro does not work.

jmf

Well that's rather sad, but did you have to send all the blank space
above just to say that? With whom have you raised bug reports? What
has their response(s) been?

 

[Wolfgang Keller]

All Java GUI frameworks I know of are ridiculous garbage.

Pray tell is there anything that is not ridiculous garbage or is your
computer so hopelessly broken that everything fails on it? You've
already dissed on Windows, Firefox, the web, Java.

If Windows, Firefox, "the web" and Java are "everything" that you know
of in terms of IT, then I pity those poor people who have to succumb
to your "competence".

Surely Python must suck also because it's slow and interpreted.

I don't draw skewed parallels.

Instead I base my judgments on my personal experience from those
decades of screenwork for various tasks with various applications on
various systems, correlated with the experience of all those
knowledgeable people I've learned to know during that time, as well as
logical deductive thinking.

Sincerely,

Wolfgang

 

[Ned Batchelder]

If Windows, Firefox, "the web" and Java are "everything" that you know
of in terms of IT, then I pity those poor people who have to succumb
to your "competence".

He didn't say it was all he knew. It sounds like you are saying he is
incompetent. I hope that isn't what you meant.

 

[Wolfgang Keller]

With Windows systems, I waste something like 90% of my work time

Something is wrong then.

You bet.

Windows has its issues, and it does slow down over time as cruft in
the system accumulates. And Windows XP is getting slower and slower
due to a bug in the automatic updates service, but in general, but
your experience with Windows is not normal.

With Windows it *is* "normal". An experienced software developer
once even explained the reason to me. When a single process on Windows
does I/O, then the system essentially falls back to "single tasking".
Or (non-)"cooperative multitasking" at best, depending on how
dissocial the developer of that process is.

I managed hundreds of Windows workstations in my previous
life and I did not see this occur with any regularity.

Well, because you only "managed" those computers, you never tried to
accomplish actual *work* with them.

So something is wrong with your setup. Maybe its time for a
re-install? Virus or malware?

Windows itself is the problem.

Or maybe you need to upgrade to Windows 7?

Won't change anything.

Sincerely,

Wolfgang