How to teach someone HTML/CSS?

[Sherm Pendley]

Yes. Especially for someone coming from a graphic design background,
this is important.

What role will these designers be playing?

I've been on teams where the designers did no HTML at all - they just
did PSDs, cut them up, and handed them over to developers to implement
as HTML. If that's what your designers do, then it'd be most useful for
them to know the general principles involved, like the idea that the
page size is fluid rather than static, than for them to get bogged down
in HTML coding and other implementation details they may never need.

sherm--

 

[Jan Faerber]

Why?

"Hey, hey Wiki! Hey Wiki hey." I am not a kid. I like the "Yahoo
Answers" much more.

 

[Jan Faerber]

"Hey, hey Wiki! Hey Wiki hey." I am not a kid. I like the "Yahoo
Answers" much more.

And I think Lutz Heilmann was right when he arranged to close the german
wiki.
http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/1...in-and-thousand-are-reading-the-evil-article/

The man know better what is fact and what not because he know what is a
system because he served in a secret agency.

From me Wikipedia won't get any Cent.

 

[Jan Faerber]

And I think Lutz Heilmann was right when he arranged to close the german
wiki.
http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/1...in-and-thousand-are-reading-the-evil-article/


The man know better what is fact and what not because he know what is a
system because he served in a secret agency.

From me Wikipedia won't get any Cent.

And wiki entries have always first rank in google results. Google's shit
net.

 

[Andy Dingley]

I've been on teams where the designers did no HTML at all - they just
did PSDs, cut them up, and handed them over to developers to implement
as HTML. If that's what your designers do, then it'd be most useful ...

....to shoot them now and get it over with.

 

[Sherm Pendley]

And wiki entries have always first rank in google results. Google's
shit net.

Okay, I've heard enough of your babble. Into the killfile you go.

*plonk*

sherm--

 

[Bergamot]

I've been on teams where the designers did no HTML at all - they just
did PSDs, cut them up, and handed them over to developers to implement
as HTML.

If the designer isn't doing any coding, they should *not* be the one to
cut up a PSD file. That task is best left to whoever is going to
implement the design.

 

[Sherm Pendley]

If the designer isn't doing any coding, they should *not* be the one
to cut up a PSD file. That task is best left to whoever is going to
implement the design.

In the teams I'm referring to, the designers chose the compression type
and amount - finding an acceptable quality/compression compromise was
part of the designer's job, and they did that on a per-slice basis.

It was rarely a problem in practice. If you have well-trained designers
who are aware of the principles of flexible pages, they can usually cut
the designs up the right way. In about two and a half years at this
particular job, I only needed to "push back" and have a PSD recut two,
maybe three times.

Keep in mind, I'm talking about professional designers who knew their
jobs well, not clueless "deeziners" who insist on nailing everything
into a fixed position. One doesn't need to have memorized the HTML spec
in order to understand the limitations and capabilities of the medium.

sherm--

 

[Joy Beeson]

Agreed. Will probably go with Notepad++ as it's what I'm most familiar with

Ask each student what his favorite text editor is. If a text editor
he likes and knows how to use is anywhere near suitable, let him use
it. If he has none, tell him to use Notepad. If his favorite is
unsuitable, explain why it's unsuitable.

 

[Bergamot]

Keep in mind, I'm talking about professional designers who knew their
jobs well, not clueless "deeziners" who insist on nailing everything
into a fixed position.

I've personally only dealt with the latter, who cannot be trusted to
slice up a PSD correctly. I'm working with one now, as a matter of fact.
I have repeatedly tried to teach her some of the differences between web
and print media, but she just doesn't get it and I don't think she ever
will. Every new project I have to train her all over again. <sigh>

I think there are far more designers like her than those professionals
you speak of who know their jobs well. I've never met one, myself.

 

[dorayme]

I've personally only dealt with the latter, who cannot be trusted to
slice up a PSD correctly. I'm working with one now, as a matter of fact.
I have repeatedly tried to teach her some of the differences between web
and print media, but she just doesn't get it and I don't think she ever
will. Every new project I have to train her all over again. <sigh>

Is there anything good about her? Is she drop dead gorgeous or anything
like that?

 

[rf]

Is there anything good about her? Is she drop dead gorgeous or anything
like that?

I have one that insisted on having round thumbnails.

Do you know how *hard* it is to convince PHP to convert a rectangular
picture to a round thumbnail?

 

[dorayme]

I have one that insisted on having round thumbnails.

Do you know how *hard* it is to convince PHP to convert a rectangular
picture to a round thumbnail?

I believe you!

 

[Nik Coughlin]

I have one that insisted on having round thumbnails.

Do you know how *hard* it is to convince PHP to convert a rectangular
picture to a round thumbnail?

It becomes trivial if you can apply masks to your images. Also good for
things like making rectangular images have rounded corners etc.

I wrote some code to do this ages ago but I can't find it, Google found this
for me though:
http://php.amnuts.com/index.php?do=view&id=15&PHPSESSID=b39674cb81a777f90d78372529eac4f4

 

[Adrienne Boswell]

Gazing into my crystal ball I observed Joy Beeson

Ask each student what his favorite text editor is. If a text editor
he likes and knows how to use is anywhere near suitable, let him use
it. If he has none, tell him to use Notepad. If his favorite is
unsuitable, explain why it's unsuitable.

I don't think that Notepad is a good choice, especially for someone who
might be new to a text editor. A text editor should at least have
syntax highlighting and line numbering, Notepad has neither.

 

[Ari Heino]

Adrienne Boswell kirjoitti seuraavasti:

A text editor should at least have
syntax highlighting and line numbering, Notepad has neither.

I think (hope) Nik meant Notepad++ when he said Notepad. Notepad++ has
syntax highlighting.

 

[Chaddy2222]

I've personally only dealt with the latter, who cannot be trusted to
slice up a PSD correctly. I'm working with one now, as a matter of fact.
I have repeatedly tried to teach her some of the differences between web
and print media, but she just doesn't get it and I don't think she ever
will. Every new project I have to train her all over again. <sigh>

Make her surf the web for an entire day (useing eather a mobile phone
or PDA), that should do it.

Sometimes people just need some practicle experience, I mean it is
almost impossible to describe to a sighted person what a screen
reader / text to speach reader does with a website.

I think there are far more designers like her than those professionals
you speak of who know their jobs well. I've never met one, myself.

My University unit on Web Design, and programming had code in it that
has since been deprecated by the W3C.

 

[Nik Coughlin]

My University unit on Web Design, and programming had code in it that
has since been deprecated by the W3C.

You think that's bad, I was looking at courses for someone, and one of the
providers, who shall remain anonymous, was using markup that has never been
part of the W3C standard, deprecated or not. Oh and the introductory video
on their website showed them using Frontpage. An old version at that.

 

[Chaddy2222]

You think that's bad, I was looking at courses for someone, and one of the
providers, who shall remain anonymous, was using markup that has never been
part of the W3C standard, deprecated or not.  Oh and the introductory video
on their website showed them using Frontpage.  An old version at that.

Yeah, some courses require it. But the same course I did used MS
Access as the Database for the website we were working on. But we were
meant to use Access with PHP!

 

[Joy Beeson]

Belated reply -- since I know nothing about HTML and wanted to know
what there is to be learned, I saved this thread to read during the
two hours a day I'm awake, which slowed things down considerably, then
Christmas stuff intervened, then I spent a week out of town and
haven't caught up yet.

But I do have some experience as a teacher, and lots of experience as
a student, and repetition *with pauses in between* is the key.

So I would advise introducing the class by saying that you aren't here
to teach them CSS, but to teach them how to learn CSS -- and then
mention it again every chance you get -- at a minimum, each time you
give a topic short shrift, each time you skip a topic, and when you
dismiss them for the last time.