Asking if elements in struct arre zero

[Roose]

Will you all stop proving my point already? Are you guys 12? Can you come
up with some better insults besides stupid puns and "wart-hog-faced
buffoon"? This has gone from amusing to sad. Maybe I will stop. Just post
some more lame insults, and I'll be both bored and disgusted by your lack of
creativity, and that will end all the posts.

If anyone actually has a decent rebuttal, that relies on logical argument
rather than dogma, and who can come up with some decent insults, please feel
free.

 

[Irrwahn Grausewitz]

Will you all stop proving my point already? Are you guys 12?

Yes, but in different numerical bases.

Maybe I will stop. Just post
some more lame insults, and I'll be both bored and disgusted by your lack of
creativity, and that will end all the posts.

To good a proposal to actually become true.

If anyone actually has a decent rebuttal, that relies on logical argument
rather than dogma, and who can come up with some decent insults, please feel
free.

'Anyone' includes you, I assume. It would be far more convenient for
all if you'd just switch to insulting yourself directly without
polluting usenet with manifestations of your auto-agressive episodes.

Have an adequate day.

 

[Default User]

Yes, but in different numerical bases.

It would be better if everyone just ignored him. This is the sort of
troll (as opposed to Trollsdale) that is easy to deal with. A mass
plonking, no replies, his little fun messages drop into the void with
nary a ripple.

Those of us who killfiled him right away would be blissfully unaware of
his screed if others didn't reply to him.




Brian Rodenborn

 

[Noah Roberts]

Answer: Top Posting

Which theory? Sort by thread. It doesn't take a genius. Even if I quote
nothing, then you just go to the previous in the thread. There is no
hunting.

The problem with your theory is that this requires that I hunt down the
message that contains the text you are replying to in order for your
post to make any kind of sense. If you want your post to make sense it
should contain enough of the origional for your comment to make sense.
I am not going to back up and read the one before just because you
refuse to be courtious.

Question: What is the most annoying thing in Usenet?

BTW, *PLONK* from work also.

 

[Mark McIntyre]

Are you using a newreader made before 1991? Don't you have an option to
view messages by thread? There is a perfectly serviceable one available for
free called Outlook Express, if you use Windows.

1) please don't top post
2) please don't troll - Outhouse is not a perfectrly serviceable
newsreader, its a massive virus backdoor.
3) my newsreader is perfectly capable of threading, as you presumably
know since someone as supposedly usenet-guruesque as yourself can
presumably read the headers.

What the hell are you talking about infinite disk space? This thread is
only 3 days old, genius.

Do you have the slightest clue how much diskspace even the text-only
newsgroups take up per day? Not to mention the binaries. I'm not
wasting my diskspace storing that.

There is enough context for any of hundreds of messages in any group I read.

I'm happy for you .I however do not keep old messages. I've read them,
why should I keep them.
Plus there's a rule in CLC htat you retain context so that people
don't /have/ to read old messages. Either get with the plot, or get
plonked.

You said you killfiled me already,

No, I killfile you when you start telling people wrong C answers.
Right now you're just an annoying idiot.

 

[Mark McIntyre]

See the other post -- just use a newsreader where you can group by thread.

1) please don't top post
2) what other post? You need to include some context
3) please learn to snip - you don't seem to need RJH's message below,
so why not snip it?

I find it hilarious that you live in such a regimented, literal-minded world
that you cannot tell that I meant only for top-posting dogmatists to
killfile me.

This is a technical newsgroup. If you want to achieve something, say
it, don't rely on people reading your mind. We don't bring our crystal
balls to usenet.

You must be great to have a conversation with.

So my friends tell me.

 

[Mark McIntyre]

So, have you killfiled me yet or not? Do you plan to?

who are you talking to? Include some context so that your posts make
sense

This is a test.

please post tests to alt.test.

If not, you're a blithering idiot.

Did I already mention pots and kettles?

Have you noticed that UseNet is public and that comp.lang.c is unmoderated?

Yup.

That means that, sadly, you cannot control it,

Incorrect. It means its self moderating. You're observing this process
in action.

life. It is an interesting exercise to consider the psychological
motivation of why you continue to try.

Nothing psychological, its merely that some of us value standards, and
others don't give a sh*t about behaving politely.

 

[Mark McIntyre]

If anyone actually has a decent rebuttal, that relies on logical argument
rather than dogma,

We've done that already. But to recap:
1) context is important in technical groups. When responding to a
post, you should include enough context at the relevant point to make
your remarks meaningful. This cannot be achieved by top posting.

2) In order to retain as much sense as possible. posts in technical
groups should be considered conversations. Just as in conversations,
answers go AFTER questions, not before. This allows new joiners to a
thread to read a summary of the arguments so far, and catch up on the
thread, even with less able newsreaders.

3) top posting encourages bandwidth wastage, as there is a tendency
not to snip gratuitous or unneeded material.

and who can come up with some decent insults, please feel
free.

I have lots, but my ISP filters all outbound posts, so I can't call
you a fetid pile of stinking dingo's kidneys, or remark that you look
as though you'd been hung upside down with your head in a bucket of
rancid hyena offal for a week.

 

[Roose]

I agree with your points, and that is why I never complain about
bottom-posting. There are valid reasons for bottom posting, which is why I
do it sometimes, as I already said. But there are valid reasons for
top-posting as well, which I already listed. And that is why I get pissed
when people complain about ME top-posting.

The bottom line is that it is personal preference, and UseNet is public, so
I have the right to follow my preference. Just like everyone has the right
to post their f*cking stupid sigs after every goddamn message.

However, I am less pissed now than amused by the fact that I've caused a
collective apoplexy in comp.lang.c, over something as stupid as top-posting.

 

[Roose]

Do you have the slightest clue how much diskspace even the text-only

newsgroups take up per day? Not to mention the binaries. I'm not
wasting my diskspace storing that.

Well, I looked in my outlook folder, and it's 26 megs, for about 40
newsgroups from two news servers, including a several binary groups. That's
because it only downloads the headers at first.

don't /have/ to read old messages. Either get with the plot, or get
plonked.

THAT'S WHAT I'VE BEEN TELLING YOU TO DO, IDIOT, SO FUCKING DO IT ALREADY. I
already made clear that I'm going to top-post when I feel like it. Notice
that I didn't this time, because there were multiple points to address.

 

[Micah Cowan]

I agree with your points, and that is why I never complain about
bottom-posting. There are valid reasons for bottom posting, which is why I
do it sometimes, as I already said. But there are valid reasons for
top-posting as well, which I already listed. And that is why I get pissed
when people complain about ME top-posting.

But regardless of your preferences, you are expected to abide by
the rules of etiquette and social courtesy set forth by the NG to
which you post. This newsgroup has a very clear preference for
bottom-posting, and an active hatred toward top-posting.

In USENET, you are expected to read a group for a couple weeks
before posting to it.

The bottom line is that it is personal preference, and UseNet is public, so
I have the right to follow my preference.

In which case, we also have the right to killfile you. And you
should expect such when you treat others with such spite.

Just like everyone has the right
to post their f*cking stupid sigs after every goddamn message.

But this is different: this is *long*-standing
USENET-acceptable. Top-posting is not, though some of the younger
groups are apathetic about it. In such groups, I don't correct
people's top-posting, and my response will be in kind, except
when I just can't do that (e.g., when I'm responding
item-by-item, such as in this post).

However, I am less pissed now than amused by the fact that I've caused a
collective apoplexy in comp.lang.c, over something as stupid as top-posting.

The issue is not top-posting: the issue is continued rudeness
towards a group in which you are currently a *guest*.

 

[Micah Cowan]

Well, I looked in my outlook folder, and it's 26 megs, for about 40
newsgroups from two news servers, including a several binary groups. That's
because it only downloads the headers at first.

No -- he's talking about actually *running* a news server. People
who do that are committing themselves to willingly giving up
*huge* disk for the sake of others.

 

[Roose]

No, I don't think he is. In any case, it's not relevant if he's talking
about running a news server. I said that it is easy to track a thread even
without quoting, if you have a proper newsreader which sorts by thread. He
said that that isn't possible because you would have to store too many
messages on your machine. I say, not really, they're on the server.

There is no disk space issue with tracking messages backward by thread, in
order to follow a conversation without quoting.

 

[Roose]

In USENET, you are expected to read a group for a couple weeks

before posting to it.

Says who? There is no President of UseNet.

In which case, we also have the right to killfile you. And you
should expect such when you treat others with such spite.

And I have encouraged people who get riled up about something as stupid as
top-posting to killfile me. In fact, I have repeatedly asked them to, and
they still haven't.

But this is different: this is *long*-standing
USENET-acceptable. Top-posting is not, though some of the younger

That is not a good enough reason for me. The English language is a standard
as well, but it changes with time and de facto rules evolve. Old rules get
broken. Same thing with UseNet. It has changed over time to include
top-posting as acceptable.

The issue is not top-posting: the issue is continued rudeness
towards a group in which you are currently a *guest*.

I am no more a guest than you are. I probably posted here in 1995, well
before most people here. Because you post here a lot doesn't mean you own
the group.

 

[Roose]

The issue is not top-posting: the issue is continued rudeness

towards a group in which you are currently a *guest*.

And about the rudeness, it seems to be one of the accepted norms in this
group. Every other post is "blah blah you idiot, there is no such thing in
standard C" or "No, you can't do that, stupid". I started with a simple
question, it was someone else who answered with the "Don't top-post" BS.

The rudeness also serves the purpose of showing everyone what hypocrites
they are. If they consider me a troll, then they should follow netiquette
and killfile _without comment_.

 

[Richard Heathfield]

Says who? There is no President of UseNet.

"Read both mailing lists and newsgroups for one to two months before you
post anything. This helps you to get an understanding of the culture of
the group." - RFC 1855.

I see you're finally quoting context. Well done.

And I have encouraged people who get riled up about something as stupid as
top-posting to killfile me. In fact, I have repeatedly asked them to, and
they still haven't.

It's not for you, or anyone else except me, to decide who goes into my
killfile.

That is not a good enough reason for me. The English language is
a standard as well, but it changes with time and de facto rules
evolve.

Indeed. And they have done so in comp.lang.c, too.

Old rules get broken. Same thing with UseNet.

Only if the old rules cease to make sense in new circumstances. That isn't
the case here.

It has changed over time to include
top-posting as acceptable.

Not in comp.lang.c. Newsgroups have their own cultures, which you would do
well to respect.

I am no more a guest than you are. I probably posted here in 1995, well
before most people here.

That's a lie. There have been no articles by Roose, EVER, in the comp.lang.c
newsgroup except in this very thread, according to the archives.

Because you post here a lot doesn't mean you own the group.

No, but neither does /not/ posting here a lot.

 

[Roose]

"Read both mailing lists and newsgroups for one to two months before you

post anything. This helps you to get an understanding of the culture of
the group." - RFC 1855.

Thanks, check out this one too:

"Don't get involved in flame wars. Neither post nor respond to incendiary
material."

You're in no position to tell me not to top-post, clearly. And this is not
recognition of those rules as authority.

I see you're finally quoting context. Well done.

I already said that I am perfectly capable of quoting, when I think it's
more clear. I top-post when that's more clear.

Only if the old rules cease to make sense in new circumstances. That isn't
the case here.

The new circumstances are that most people use different newsreaders than
they did 10 years ago. Back in the day, the ergonomics of newsreaders
demanded that you quote. Now they don't, as there are zillions of free
newsreaders that let you track threads quite easily.

Just like HTML e-mail used to be an ungodly annoyance, it is coming into
acceptance because of greater disk space, bandwidth, and more e-mail clients
support it. Oh times they change.

That's a lie. There have been no articles by Roose, EVER, in the comp.lang.c
newsgroup except in this very thread, according to the archives.

Apparently you don't really understand how Usenet works.

No, but neither does /not/ posting here a lot.

No shit. I never said that I owned the group. You're the ones telling ME
what to do. I'm not telling you to do anything. I simply suggest that if
you're so keen on following netiquette, then killfile me already.

 

[James Hu]

You're in no position to tell me not to top-post, clearly. And this
is not recognition of those rules as authority.

Of course, it is obvious the only rules you recognize as having any
authority are your own.

I already said that I am perfectly capable of quoting, when I think
it's more clear. I top-post when that's more clear.

Obviously, it is a convention of this newsgroup to not top-post. Just
like it is convention to not bring crying babies into the movie theater.
It doesn't mean it doesn't ever happen, but when it does, the convention
breaker will get complaints. If you don't want to put up with the
complaining, why not killfile the complainers?

The new circumstances are that most people use different newsreaders
than they did 10 years ago. Back in the day, the ergonomics of
newsreaders demanded that you quote. Now they don't, as there are
zillions of free newsreaders that let you track threads quite easily.

This is a rather idyllic view. In reality, the supported features of
a news reader is dependent upon multiple factors, including, but not
limited to:

* whether the feature is implemented in the news reader
* whether the user is reading the news from a local spool or
a remote server
* whether or not the the user is reading the news offline
* whether the remote server supports all the features supported
by the client

As to which client any particular user may be using, that is a personal
choice, and the conventions of this newsgroup are such that the least
capable news reader can participate just as efficiently as the most
capable news reader.

To consider your example of threading, some commercial NNTP services
do not support the retrieval of an entire thread because it involves
a very expensive search of their, often proprietary, news database.

Others may read their news in an offline mode, to save on dial up
expenses, or reduce the amount of time the phone line is tied up by the
internet connection. In such cases, they may not have the complete
thread cached when they read a particular article.

Just like HTML e-mail used to be an ungodly annoyance, it is coming
into acceptance because of greater disk space, bandwidth, and more
e-mail clients support it. Oh times they change.

The more things change, the more things stay the same.

HTML e-mail is even more annoying these days, because spammers that
generate random e-mail targets now get a web server ping from your
e-mail reader, thus validating your e-mail address.

Apparently you don't really understand how Usenet works.

You are so keen on getting people to killfile you, but you now openly
admit that you freely change your Usenet identity.

No shit.

Why, you're a potty-mouthed wart-hog-faced buffoon!

I never said that I owned the group. You're the ones
telling ME what to do.

I can't speak for everyone, but I was complaining about how you rudely
responded to a request to follow this groups netiquette, and then you
continued to rudely assert that you will do as you please. Which, to
me, implies you don't respect the members of this newsgroup that wish
you to follow netiquette.

Of course, what you do always remains your choice. Just like what
we do (which may include loud complainig) remains ours.

I'm not telling you to do anything. I simply
suggest that if you're so keen on following netiquette, then killfile
me already.

I repeat: If you don't want to put up with the complaining, why not
killfile the complainers?

....

ObC: So, what is the right way to print the value of a variable of type
int32_t? The best I can think of is:

int32_t i = 42;
printf("%jd\n", (intmax_t)i);

Is there a better way?

-- James

 

[Irrwahn Grausewitz]

I started with a simple
question, it was someone else who answered with the "Don't top-post" BS.

Nope, 't was: "Please don't top-post."
^^^^^^

 

[Noah Roberts]

Nope, 't was: "Please don't top-post."
^^^^^^

Not only that but they answered his question very nicely while very
politely asking him not to top post. His thank you was a big **** you.