J
Johnny
Pascal Bourguignon said:
Xah probably couldn't find any LispM based servers. Can you blame him?
Xah probably couldn't find any LispM based servers. Can you blame him?
G
Greg Ewing
Andre said:
CP/M files weren't quite exactly streams of bytes. They
were more like streams of 128-byte blocks (hence the
kludge of using control-Z to mark the end of a text
file).
A
Andre Majorel
Wasn't it in version 2 that they added directories and
Unix-style file handles ?
J
John W. Kennedy
Andre said:
Yes, and also a single-process pipe emulator. Ever since 2.0, MS has
been trying to turn MS-DOS (later, Windows) into a Unix clone.
C
Charles Shannon Hendrix
["Followup-To:" header set to alt.folklore.computers.]
Well, there is always Witchunt by Rush...
Well, there is always Witchunt by Rush...
V
Ville Vainio
John> Yes, and also a single-process pipe emulator. Ever since
John> 2.0, MS has been trying to turn MS-DOS (later, Windows) into
John> a Unix clone.
With very little success. Notepad still only understands cr-lf line
breaks, and / as path separator still screws up most of their cmd line
programs (which think / is for command line options).
Microsoft probably thought avoiding compatibility is a good idea, and
have only lately started to have some regrets, visible as the release
& future integration of SFU. Migrating ppl from Unix probably *is*
easier when you are not doing your best to make interoperability as
painful as possible.
John> 2.0, MS has been trying to turn MS-DOS (later, Windows) into
John> a Unix clone.
With very little success. Notepad still only understands cr-lf line
breaks, and / as path separator still screws up most of their cmd line
programs (which think / is for command line options).
Microsoft probably thought avoiding compatibility is a good idea, and
have only lately started to have some regrets, visible as the release
& future integration of SFU. Migrating ppl from Unix probably *is*
easier when you are not doing your best to make interoperability as
painful as possible.
C
Charles Shannon Hendrix
["Followup-To:" header set to alt.folklore.computers.]
Um... maybe it's paid for?
I use things daily that I hate... I can't afford to replace them.
Maybe if the people had no *plans* to replace the Explorer, or they
turned around and bought yet another one, I could see your point.
Um... maybe it's paid for?
I use things daily that I hate... I can't afford to replace them.
Maybe if the people had no *plans* to replace the Explorer, or they
turned around and bought yet another one, I could see your point.
C
Craig A. Finseth
...
Wrong. The / was chosen as the command line option separator because
whoever wrote MSDOS was looking to CP/M, who modelled their commands
after a PDP-11 operating system (RT-11?). Consider the "PIP" command.
When they went to MS/DOS 2.0 and needed path separators, they found
that "/" was already taken, so they used "\". But there was a hidden
way to tell the command interpreter that it could use "-" for options.
And in all systems starting with 2.0, the system calls have taken "/"
and "\" interchangably.
Craig, who wrote a lot of code for CP/M, MS-DOS 1* and Later....
C
CBFalconer
R
Rich Teer
.... And has failed miserably to do so.
--
Rich Teer, SCNA, SCSA, author of "Solaris Systems Programming",
published in August 2004.
President,
Rite Online Inc.
Voice: +1 (250) 979-1638
URL: http://www.rite-group.com/rich
R
red floyd
A
Andre Majorel
Whoever = Tim Paterson, then working for Seattle Computer
Products. Interesting historical stuff at
http://www.patersontech.com/Dos/
I
Ian Wilson
David said:
Sorry, I don't see how an activity can be affected by something that has
nothing to do with that activity.
Are you suggesting that Unix users don't have to deal with unixism? If
that were so, why would Xah Lee have such a bee in his bonnet about it? [2]
Xah Lee says "unix should mean unixism, the way things are done in unix
platform" [1]
Xah Lee also says "the unix shells ... is one giant unpurgeable shit
pile arose from ad hoc hacks of unixism." [2]
It seems legit to wonder why he chooses to place his web-pages amongst
shit piles.
[1]
The world unix should mean unixism, that is, the way things are done in
unix platform, their culture, their hacking attitude, their social
attitude, their preferences, their people, their tools, their languages,
their ps grep config make shebang tartall gunzip README manifesto et cetera.
http://www.xahlee.org/UnixResource_dir/freebooks.html
[2]
By the way, the unix shells and environment variable and ways, is quite
a fucked up one. It is amazing to see its stupidities alluded as an
advance for some language design argument. The whole morbidity of the
prospect to place an executable script as any program name in any path
with the fucked up ways to search for programs to execute and the fucked
up way to determine whether it is a program by the fucked up permission
bits system is one giant unpurgeable shit pile arose from ad hoc hacks
of unixism.
http://www.xahlee.org/Writ_dir/comp_lang_lisp/124.txt
All hail!
G
Guest
On 31 Aug 2004 16:06:31 GMT, Craig A. Finseth <[email protected]>
wrote:
Which got removed quite some back.
wrote:
Which got removed quite some back.
G
Guest
WordPerfect PE or later ED. No longer sold, AFAIK.
S
Sherm Pendley
red said:
Anyone else remember Blackbeard?
sherm--
J
James Keasley
Arr Sherm, me-lad, that I do, great man, never got his
round in though
J
John W. Kennedy
Craig said:
Except, of course, that it was useless, because 99% of programs did
their own option parsing, and still do. The hidden option only lasted
one .1 subrelease, as I recall.
....which is /one/ thing that the FLOSS community can honestly thank them
for.
J
John W. Kennedy
Not entirely. Porting GNU software and the like to MS-DOS and Windows
could be a hell of a lot more difficult than it is. Try porting almost
anything to, for example, the MVS (classic) environment (which is why
MVS now also includes a Unix-wise alternate environment).
--
John W. Kennedy
"You can, if you wish, class all science-fiction together; but it is
about as perceptive as classing the works of Ballantyne, Conrad and W.
W. Jacobs together as the 'sea-story' and then criticizing _that_."
-- C. S. Lewis. "An Experiment in Criticism"
R
Rob Warnock
+---------------
| >... and / as path separator still screws up most of their cmd line
| >programs (which think / is for command line options).
| >Microsoft probably thought avoiding compatibility is a good idea, and
| >have only lately started to have some regrets...
|
| Wrong. The / was chosen as the command line option separator because
| whoever wrote MSDOS was looking to CP/M, who modelled their commands
| after a PDP-11 operating system (RT-11?).
+---------------
Which, like PS/8 & OS-8 [and "DECsystem-8" from Geordia Tech] for the
PDP-8, modelled the command syntax after that of the venerable PDP-10!!
+---------------
| Consider the "PIP" command.
+---------------
Indeed. And COPY & DEL & DIR, etc.
-Rob
| >... and / as path separator still screws up most of their cmd line
| >programs (which think / is for command line options).
| >Microsoft probably thought avoiding compatibility is a good idea, and
| >have only lately started to have some regrets...
|
| Wrong. The / was chosen as the command line option separator because
| whoever wrote MSDOS was looking to CP/M, who modelled their commands
| after a PDP-11 operating system (RT-11?).
+---------------
Which, like PS/8 & OS-8 [and "DECsystem-8" from Geordia Tech] for the
PDP-8, modelled the command syntax after that of the venerable PDP-10!!
+---------------
| Consider the "PIP" command.
+---------------
Indeed. And COPY & DEL & DIR, etc.
-Rob